Dr. John Fea is a professor of history at Messiah College in Pennsylvania. He has been an outspoken critic of those who believe that America had a Christian founding or think ministers should be active in politics. 1 In addition to being an historian, he writes political columns praising those on the political left. For example, he called President Barack Obama “the most explicitly Christian president in American history,” and asserted that his “piety, use of the Bible, and references to Christian faith and theology put most other American presidents to shame.” 2 Given Professor Fea’s political disposition, it is perhaps not surprising that his blog posts and opinion pieces on political issues are regularly critical of religious conservatives.
Monday, September 5, 2016
Barton: "No Professor Fea, The Founders Did Not Want Ministers to Stay out of Politics"
From "Dr." David Barton here. As it begins:
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11 comments:
"Dr." David Barton
Are we going to get those scare quotes going forward whenever W. Throckmorton is referenced? His terminal degree is an EdD from Ohio University in 'community counseling', which he was awarded consequent to a thesis on criteria applied in the award of 3d party payments to persons operating counseling practices (which he was doing at the time). He managed to run on for 130,000 words on that topic.
Throckmorton's is still a real doctorate from an accredited university. Barton's is honorary.
FYI: http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/who-dr-david-barton
Throckmorton's is still a real doctorate from an accredited university.
I never suggested it was artificial.
WT was schooled as well at Central Michigan University and Cedarville College. To find out what the deal in these loci 35 years ago, you'd have to look at period circulars. As we speak, about 1/3 of the faculty at Cedarville have practitioner's licenses and the curriculum tends toward a broad spectrum of introductory courses. Central Michigan's program is explicitly designed to train clinicians, and the overlap between their coursework and what you might see offered in an ordinary college psychology department today is modest. The psych department at the private college I know best has about a dozen faculty. The number with this kind of training is zero. The counseling staff might have this sort of background, but they don't have a teaching schedule.
Grove City's business model works for them, and I've seen before and after assessments of general education which place Grove City's students at the top of the heap. An aspect of their business model is recruiting people with a nexus of associations which fit with the college's architectonic mission (or at least fit when they hire them), which means they let some things slide. Michael Coulter, to take one example, is an alumnus who was hired with an MA and completed his dissertation later, quite unremarkable in 1963, not 30-odd years later. He's the issue of the Institute for Philosophical Studies at the University of Dallas, a unique program.
Are we going to get those scare quotes going forward whenever W. Throckmorton is referenced? His terminal degree is an EdD from Ohio University in 'community counseling', which he was awarded consequent to a thesis on criteria applied in the award of 3d party payments to persons operating counseling practices (which he was doing at the time). He managed to run on for 130,000 words on that topic.
Are you sure? What's your source? An EdD is a joke. That thesis looks on par with something you'd write for a correspondence school on a Hotel Management major.
He used to be an ex-gay ministry/therapy type reviled by the gay advocacy cabal.
https://exgaywatch.com/2004/08/ex-gay-watch-pr-2/
Now he's become a pro-gay advocate and reviles his old mates [and of course, the religious right].
A real piece of work, that one.
Wiki is saying it's a PhD.
It was issued by the Ed School at Ohio University. IIRC, they currently admit about 15 students a year to that graduate program. Some undertake course work there and some just write a thesis. His thesis is listed in GoogleScholar and there's a circulating copy available at Ohio University's main library.
The question at hand is what you call a research degree issued by a vocational faculty, and whether his is a research degree. His topic is more in keeping with a thesis you might expect under the auspices of a business school. IIRC, his undergraduate degree was in psychology. Cedarville's business school has a finance major, but nothing in their curriculum about insurance. Whether they did nor not 40 years ago, who knows?
So, calling it a PhD is a judgment call. His thesis certainly is verbose.
So, it's been a strange trip for WT. It's a thesis on a business topic under the auspices of a counseling program at an education school atop clinical training. He was hired by Grove City as director of counseling (which includes a teaching schedule). He published some papers in professional journals over the years running from 1996 to 2005 (unusual for someone in that position), some articles or essays which are not classified as research, then some modest research projects which incorporated reviewing patient files. In 2005, he was replaced as counseling director for some reason and put to work teaching full time. He also cut ties with a professional association he'd been a member of up to that point (one regarded as outre in mental health circles) and began attacking its members. A half dozen years later, he emerges as the producer of self-published works on late-colonial / early federal history, and bearer of serial grudges (against David Barton, Michael Peroutka, David Whitney, Scott Lively, &c), including men who didn't know him from a cord of wood and were befuddled that someone they'd never heard of was trying to get their speaking engagements cancelled.
TVD - "An EdD is a joke. That thesis looks on par with something you'd write for a correspondence school on a Hotel Management major."
Please feel free to list your superior credentials. BS? MS? PhD? Surely some high school.
I'll have you know I am indeed a high school graduate.
Second honors.
Wow, I take a break for a few months to start the family business, and I come back to find another Barton controversy taking over the blog. I guess some things never change.
I took the time to read both of Fea's articles as well as Barton's article, and I have to say that Barton did a much better job with the historical material than Fea did. Over all, I'd say that both men had some good points, but I think that both of them are letting personal animosities get in the way of a potentially enlightening discussion.
Nice to see you, Bill. You have the floor.
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