tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post8328581437707874268..comments2024-03-27T18:18:11.525-06:00Comments on American Creation: Was American Founded as a Christian Nation?Brad Harthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17669677047039491864noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-78369816938809004402010-11-29T14:27:29.451-07:002010-11-29T14:27:29.451-07:00"BUT the Constitution is Christian and contai..."BUT the Constitution is Christian and contains a Christian reference in Article I, Section 7."<br /><br />Not really. The two so-references to Christianity in the Constitution were so nominal that, were we to extract a political theology from them, we could assert the US was founded on nominal Christianity.<br /><br />A covenant to the Triune God (instead of a no-religious test clause) would have made the Constitution much more identifiably Christian.Jonathan Rowehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04079637406589278386noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-65772008886502010742010-11-29T10:24:43.168-07:002010-11-29T10:24:43.168-07:001) America is NOT a nation at all. Only ignorant f...1) America is NOT a nation at all. Only ignorant folks call the US America. Mexico, Canada, et al are all America.<br /><br />The United States is not and never was a Nation. The terms Nation and National were removed during the original convention at the behest of Mr. Ellsworth because "they were not forming a nation nor was the government national." Folks need to get educated about the US.<br /><br />The USA are a Union of Nations, sometimes refered to as States. The Nations are free and independent members of the Union called the United States of America.<br /><br />2) Formed/founded - when the Constitution was ratified by the first 9. Since the Articles were repudiated by the Convention, the system was reset by the ratification.<br /><br />3) Christian - maybe not as a Nation since no nation exists except in the minds of those who were brainwashed by the Pledge of Allegiance. <br /><br />BUT the Constitution is Christian and contains a Christian reference in Article I, Section 7.<br /><br />And most of the individual nations/states that joined the Union were very specific in their acceptable religion.fwbnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-17410678941642721272010-11-26T14:51:59.213-07:002010-11-26T14:51:59.213-07:00Tom, very good post. Well said.
Having grown up ...Tom, very good post. Well said. <br /><br />Having grown up in Christian circles, I used to say America was founded as a Christian nation. But, I'm reminded of Paul's words in I Corinthians 13: "When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me." <br /><br />For me, that was about the time I hit college. I soon realized that life doesn't come in neat packages and pretty sound bytes. Reality is complex. <br /><br />Good article!Brian Tubbshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15412421076480479001noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-60093554632069320982010-11-26T12:02:07.207-07:002010-11-26T12:02:07.207-07:00All true, Daniel.
I wrote the essay rather even-h...All true, Daniel.<br /><br />I wrote the essay rather even-handedly, but my take is that anyone who asks "Was America Founded as a Christian Nation" is setting it up so the answer is "no." [They always use those exact words and that formulation.]<br /><br />No. Ceremonial deism, godless constitution.<br /><br />Case closed, religion and the Founding, move along, nothing to see here, you stupid fundies.Tom Van Dykehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07121072404143877596noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-27951535852949601882010-11-26T09:59:37.343-07:002010-11-26T09:59:37.343-07:00Tom,
Most interesting questions can be deconstruct...Tom,<br />Most interesting questions can be deconstructed to show that they are essentially meaningless? But your deconstruction does not demonstrate that the question is not worth asking; it simply demonstrates that it is very complex. Using many possible definitions of the terms, the question remains interesting. Of course, a "yes" or "no" is neither interesting nor illunimating.Danielhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12165084874363214919noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-63280384191134306092010-11-25T03:05:43.190-07:002010-11-25T03:05:43.190-07:00England was more Christian-y. The founding was th...England was more Christian-y. The founding was the Constitution because that is what defines us today, but the DOI runs a close second in influence. Neither is Christian but DOI does appeal to a "Holy Christian" ruler without clearly specifying the Christian God. The problem which the Christian postmillenialists and dispensationalists won't admit is that calling America a Christian nation implies that salvation is by works rather than by grace and faith in Jesus Christ. So they dilute the message of the Gospel.cnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-26860298098175292412010-11-22T01:14:26.647-07:002010-11-22T01:14:26.647-07:00This hits at the core of what I have believed/argu...This hits at the core of what I have believed/argued for a while now. When people argue over terms like "Christian" and "Nation" they are merely arguing semantics. There isn't too much substance there because the substance is in the eye of the beholder. Chances are that your typical Christian conservative who has his Tevo set on Glenn Beck and Trinity Broadcasting isn't going to give two shits about what a person like Zinn, Kramnick or Moore has to say. Likewise your Bill Maher/Richard Dawkins crowd is sure to laugh themselves sick at the David Barton/Peter Lillback ilk. Either way nobody is bothering with the founders themselves. They give them lip service but no actual effort. And make no mistake; this is a POLITICAL battle and not a HISTORICAL one. The partisan participants are merely hijacking history to bolster their own partisan agenda. Fortunately us "sophisticated scholars" here at AC don't fret over semantics/politics...right? =)<br /><br />I still favor your term best, Tom. "Christian-y" is about as good as we're ever gonna get. It has weathered the storm of the past 2 years, unlike "theistic rationalist", "Judeo-Christian", "unitarian", "deist", blah, blah, blah. <br /><br />I'm beginning to think that debates over semantics are like assholes: we all have them and they all stink. There's my "scholarly" ANALysis. =)Brad Harthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17669677047039491864noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-18280194969994652322010-11-22T01:11:09.238-07:002010-11-22T01:11:09.238-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Brad Harthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17669677047039491864noreply@blogger.com