tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post7015366850124858441..comments2024-03-28T10:44:30.518-06:00Comments on American Creation: Calvinism and RightsBrad Harthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17669677047039491864noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-46823595070338094182013-06-12T05:34:19.913-06:002013-06-12T05:34:19.913-06:00That is not the correct answer, JMS. The objectiv...That is not the correct answer, JMS. The objective was not to identify the source of the quote, but to determine whether that source was influenced more by Calvin or by Locke. Of course, since you have identified the source, you must know that this statement is neither Lockean nor Calvinistic. It predates both men by several centuries, and that is the point that I am making. Aquinas recognized that the concept of government by the consent of the governed was the foundation of Mosaic Law. You mock the idea of returning to that Law (a position that I am not advocating), but do you not agree that our government should operate with the consent of the governed?Bill Fortenberryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14205053444988720146noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-43686542513469144222013-06-11T17:24:06.503-06:002013-06-11T17:24:06.503-06:00Ooh - ooh - let me guess - who else could it be - ...Ooh - ooh - let me guess - who else could it be - the be all and end all - Aquinas?<br /><br />So Bill & TVD, why not continue with the next sentence - Mosaic law - case closed, haul out Roy Moore's 10 commandments monument and establish what? Religious liberty, liberty of conscience? Hardly. JMSnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-56682289743601488572013-06-09T16:08:39.210-06:002013-06-09T16:08:39.210-06:00Y're all getting warmer..Y're all getting warmer..Tom Van Dykehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07121072404143877596noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-80645673543868987892013-06-09T07:55:31.636-06:002013-06-09T07:55:31.636-06:00wsforten - "What do y'all think?"
W...wsforten - <i>"What do y'all think?"</i><br /><br />Would your mystery writer by chance have had access to and perhaps have been schooled in Cicero and Aristotle?<br /><br />Sounds rather Cicero's <i>Republic</i> to me.jimmiraybobnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-72436975414849957072013-06-09T03:23:10.856-06:002013-06-09T03:23:10.856-06:00“Accordingly, the best form of government is in a ...<i>“Accordingly, the best form of government is in a state or kingdom, where one is given the power to preside over all; while under him are others having governing powers..."</i><br /><br />Heh heh, I figgered what you were up to, Fortenberry but I hadda look it up to make sure. Run with it. Tom Van Dykehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07121072404143877596noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-10511178758284877522013-06-08T21:02:35.422-06:002013-06-08T21:02:35.422-06:00WSforten=
Sounds more Aristotelian, or a "re...WSforten=<br /><br />Sounds more Aristotelian, or a "remix" of Aristotle by some Christian. This mixing of Aristotle's three legitimate government with a topping of divine law only superficially resembles the desert Chiefdom allegedly established by Moses.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-32270061089073512582013-06-08T20:12:42.191-06:002013-06-08T20:12:42.191-06:00With all this discussion about Calvin vs. Locke, I...With all this discussion about Calvin vs. Locke, I find myself wondering whether the following statement indicative of a Calvinistic influence or a Lockean influence:<br /><br />“Accordingly, the best form of government is in a state or kingdom, where one is given the power to preside over all; while under him are others having governing powers: and yet a government of this kind is shared by all, both because all are eligible to govern, and because the rulers are chosen by all. For this is the best form of polity, being partly kingdom, since there is one at the head of all; partly aristocracy, in so far as a number of persons are set in authority; partly democracy, i.e. government by the people, in so far as the rulers can be chosen from the people, and the people have the right to choose their rulers. Such was the form of government established by the Divine Law."<br /><br />What do y'all think?Bill Fortenberryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14205053444988720146noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-64317537555347559592013-06-08T18:40:06.690-06:002013-06-08T18:40:06.690-06:00Apropos of the discussion, I have concluded after ...<i>Apropos of the discussion, I have concluded after much investigation that Calvin himself was not good on "rights."</i><br /><br /><br />You have to go to Jean Calvin's friend, colleague, and immediate successor, Theodore Beza.<br /><br />This is why adherents prefer "Reformed theology" over the "Calvinism." There's far more to it than one man, John Calvin. Indeed, "Calvinist resistance theory" is more the work of <br /><br />http://www.davekopel.com/religion/calvinism.htm<br /><br />Beza, deMornay, Ponet, Know, Rutherford, Goodman, etc.<br /><br /><i>In 1574, Theodore Beza, one of the most influential Calvinists, published "On the Right of Magistrates over Their Subjects and the Duty of Subjects Towards their Rulers," to advance Calvin’s doctrine on the rights of intermediate magistrates. His book begins by examining the nature of government. Jesus said, “The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath.” (Mark 2:27.) Beza echoed this language: “peoples were not created for the sake of rulers, but on the contrary the rulers for the sake of the people, even as the guardian is appointed for the ward, not the ward for the guardian, and the shepherd on account of the flock, not the flock on account of the shepherd.”</i><br /><br />&c.Tom Van Dykehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07121072404143877596noreply@blogger.com