tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post6948223544312828780..comments2024-03-28T10:44:30.518-06:00Comments on American Creation: The Biblical Covenant is Undemocratic (or Unrepublican)Brad Harthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17669677047039491864noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-62706213904623147302008-08-12T10:46:00.000-06:002008-08-12T10:46:00.000-06:00Oh yeah Barton et al. love to quote how even Jeffe...Oh yeah Barton et al. love to quote how even Jefferson and Franklin looked to biblical Israel as a model for the American republic. There is a half truth; they did indeed use Israel as an example of liberation from tyranny. But Kraynak and Frazer point out that their use wasn't exactly a valid interpretation of history.Jonathan Rowehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04079637406589278386noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-91754930326503630232008-08-12T08:03:00.000-06:002008-08-12T08:03:00.000-06:00Ah, Jon. You wrote Kraynak debunks the "Christian...Ah, Jon. You wrote Kraynak debunks the "Christian Nation" thesis, I thought you meant the contemporary one. I don't see a lot of Israel in it, although you're more familiar with it than I.<BR/><BR/>Ripple, I think the actual truth claims of Christianity are not at issue on this blog, nor should they be.Tom Van Dykehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07121072404143877596noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-9377071209024066132008-08-11T15:46:00.000-06:002008-08-11T15:46:00.000-06:00Tom,You may have a point; but if you look at the l...Tom,<BR/><BR/>You may have a point; but if you look at the larger context Kraynak and Frazer aimed to debunk common but specific use of Old Testament Israel by the Founding era Whigs and show how they "read in" political liberty to the biblical record as it wasn't there.<BR/><BR/>They did something similar to Greco-Roman history as well.<BR/><BR/>And you've also seen John Adams & co. reading Judeo-Christian Providentialism into non-biblical religions. <BR/><BR/>So I guess they don't call it "Whig history" for nuthin'.Jonathan Rowehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04079637406589278386noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-15649532798787427662008-08-11T14:13:00.000-06:002008-08-11T14:13:00.000-06:00Tom, first, how do we know that "Jesus Christ" eve...Tom, first, how do we know that "Jesus Christ" ever existed, and secondly, even if we suppose that such a person did exist, how do we know that the historical Jesus meant to establish a "New Covenant"?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1237087217187172116.post-25967034322929947432008-08-10T14:19:00.000-06:002008-08-10T14:19:00.000-06:00"There is nothing voluntary or consensual about th...<I>"There is nothing voluntary or consensual about the biblical covenant..."</I><BR/><BR/><BR/>I believe Dr. Kraynak misses the point here. The "Old" Covenant is with the people of Israel. The "New" Covenant of Jesus Christ is with all men, and requires a voluntary commitment of faith to vest.Tom Van Dykehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07121072404143877596noreply@blogger.com